Smoked - Canned Kokanee

[sawhorseray]

I know the kokanee limit is three in possession per license during transport on the road. Do fish that have been canned or smoked count against this limit? We plan on heading back to FG in a couple of weeks and don't want to be in violation, tickets are expensive. RAY

 

[dubob]

Depends on which state you live in

Utah says that once you get the fish to your PERMANENT residence (and your RV isn't it unless your a full time RVer), there is no possession limit on fish. I think this change took place in 2015. You can catch a limit all 365 days of the year and as long as you take them to your permanent residence every day, you can keep as many as you want. So if you are canning them a/o smoking them at your permanent residence, then you are good to go back to the Gorge and catch and keep another limit. Don't know what the rules are for other states - like Wyoming.

 

[sawhorseray]

I've been reading up on the regs, which I should have done before I went there. It's three kokes in possession during transport back to CA, which means six for my wife and I. They have to be identifiable regardless of however one chooses to process the fish. My partner started back home yesterday after distributing a weeks worth of limit fillets throughout a campground to some happy families. I'm sure there's tons of folks who gamble on not getting caught with over limit possession and get away with it, but I like to do my gambling in a Nevada casino, not with Wyoming F&G. Spending a grand and two days each way just don't add up to six fish to bring home. We might go back there again some time, might not. RAY

 

[SuperD]

Ray, I agree with you that bringing home more than 3 fish per person would feel a lot more satisfying after traveling that far but catching and releasing Kokes of the Gorge quality every day is worth the price of admission all by itself.

 

[dubob]

Spending a grand and two days each way just don't add up to six fish to bring home. We might go back there again some time, might not. RAY

But Ray, you and your bride can also take home 16 Lake Trout along with your 6 Kokanee. Here is the Flaming Gorge guide for these fish:

Flaming Gorge Reservoir in Sweetwater County.
The creel limit on trout (excluding lake trout) shall be four (4) per
AREA 4
EXCEPTIONS TO STATEWIDE REGULATIONS
day or in possession. No more than three (3) shall be kokanee
salmon.
The creel limit on lake trout shall be eight (8) per day or in
possession. No more than one (1) lake trout shall exceed twenty eight
(28) inches.All kokanee salmon caught from September 10 through
November 30 shall be released to the water immediately.
All lake trout must be kept whole (gills and entrails may be
removed) until the angler is off the water or ice and done fishing
for the day. Once off the water or ice and done fishing for the day,
lake trout can be filleted for transportation and storage. A piece
of skin large enough to allow species identification (at least one
(1) inch square) shall remain on all fish fillets while in transit or in
the field.

Remember, Lake Trout are actually a char and their flesh is pink to red and very good to eat. Maybe not quite as good as salmon, but very close. When we reach our boat limit of Kokanee, we immediately stop fishing for Kokanee (we don't like the high mortality rate associated with C&R of Kokanee), and switch the gear over to Lake Trout gear. Smoked or pressure canned Lake Trout are delicious in our opinion. Why would you not want to avail yourself of this resource especially after coming that far to fish?

 

[sawhorseray]

You are absolutely right, that's what we'll do next time around if and when we go back We were going to go back to FG in a couple of weeks but have now gone back to our original plan of fishing Lake Davis and a couple of Oregon trips later on. I do like catching kokes and rainbows far more than lake lunkers. If there for a week and filled out on kokes in a day or two, not much to look forward to. It's a long haul. RAY

 

[dubob]

We never fish specifically for the lunker Macs as you can only keep one of those anyway. And the 2 to 5 pounders are way better to eat. So we just target the pups as they are called here abouts and have limited on them several trips last year. They are just now turning on according to the reports from the past week. I'm heading over tomorrow morning and will be there until Thursday afternoon.

 

[smokepoles]

We never fish specifically for the lunker Macs as you can only keep one of those anyway. And the 2 to 5 pounders are way better to eat. So we just target the pups as they are called here abouts and have limited on them several trips last year. They are just now turning on according to the reports from the past week. I'm heading over tomorrow morning and will be there until Thursday afternoon.

Do you mainly troll for the pups, or jig? I have never really targeted them tough usually get a few pups looking for the kokes. Indeed, some of the pups up to 2-3 lbs are as orange-fleshed as the kokanee as they are probably feeding on much the same diet to that point. Once the pups switch diets, forget it.

 

[dubob]

We troll for them using spoons. When they start to school it works fairly well. We'll see the next couple of days. thumbsup

 

[jurkneyes]

Any advice and targeting the pup lakers would be appreciated. I am trying to learn as much as I can about the kokes and lakers at the Gorge. I did not catch any small lakers up there trolling when targeting the kokes. While pulling spoons and targeting the pup lakers I had no success. I did however get one large mac down around antelope flats on spoons but I was specifically targeting the bigger macs. I tried the same set up and process up around Anvil with no success. So my question is for the smaller pups do drag your ball in the mud like you do for the larger macs? I marked and caught the smaller pups but I had to jig for them.

 

[Dorado]

Any advice and targeting the pup lakers would be appreciated. I am trying to learn as much as I can about the kokes and lakers at the Gorge. I did not catch any small lakers up there trolling when targeting the kokes. While pulling spoons and targeting the pup lakers I had no success. I did however get one large mac down around antelope flats on spoons but I was specifically targeting the bigger macs. I tried the same set up and process up around Anvil with no success. So my question is for the smaller pups do drag your ball in the mud like you do for the larger macs? I marked and caught the smaller pups but I had to jig for them.

Jigging is so much more fun than trolling! Just Putt around with your trolling motor (or better yet electric trolling motor with I-Pilot) and mark fish with your electronics. A 1/2-3/4 oz jig with a curly tail or tube jig, and a small piece of sucker meat dropped down to the marked fish and try various presentations until you find what they want. I also use 1-2 oz lead jigging spoons (Butterly style jigs, Hopkins spoons, buzz bombs) as well if the fish are more aggressive. If you are deep, braided line and a fluorocarbon leader helps detect bites....

 

[saltrunner75]

Targeting pup lakers

I am by no means an expert, but this has been working for me, I usually target Kokes, but I try to keep one downrigger 20 to 30 feet lower than I am marking the most kokes, on the deep one, I use a spoon or a rapala that looks like a small koke or rainbow, I have also done well on silver or black flatfish, It seems like if you go through a school of kokes there is usually a laker or two hanging below them, I run 4 downriggers but stacking would also work, just a pain to bring it up every time you get a hit, as I get closer to my limit of kokes more downriggers get changed and lowered to target lakers. I will be up on Friday for the day. last Friday the kokes were at 25 to 35 ft we caught the pups at 61 ft but we just wanted to get the kokes and head home, so I only put one down deep all day, pups are just starting to turn on so it will just get better for them, I would bet with the hot weather everything will be down another 10 from that,
good luck.signfishin

 

[DLM]

What about smoking, vacuum packing and shipping fish home to a neighbor or relative, there waiting for you when you get home? Just thinking......101idea101

 

[sawhorseray]

What about smoking, vacuum packing and shipping fish home to a neighbor or relative, there waiting for you when you get home? Just thinking......101idea101

We were thinking that way also DLM. Aside from the fifty miles round trip daily and the shipping expense I'd think it to be perfectly legal. I did some research and emailing about the matter and got this response from Wyoming F&G.

"Hi Ray, In Wyoming, gamefish that are fully preserved in a shelf stable form are not counted towards a possession limit. Smoked fish would be considered as part of a possession limit while in transport. Fish that are preserved/canned in a shelf stable manner would not count towards a possession limit while in transport".

I loved canned salmon and trout, especially when it's lightly smoked before canning. I've got a 22 quart pressure canner and lots of jars, and a Little Chief for travelling. What could be better than smoke/canning a limit after every mornings fishing, extend the shade awning, maybe have a beer or two for the couple of hours it takes. The canned kokes go in the camper shelf closet, you're at zero possession limit and ready for the next day. There's more than one way to skin a cat, and stay legal. We'll be back at Buckboard in six days. RAY

 

[dubob]

Welcome back

The Gorge was very good to us this past week Ray. We tried the Ranch area and the Rawlings area and caught fish in both locations. Pink, black, and orange seemed to work best in either spinners, spoons, or squid. The macs preferred brass/bronze colored lures run at 60 to 80 feet down. Most of the kokes came at 40 +/- 5 feet. I have some canning and smoking to do this weekend.

I wrote to the Utah DWR about this smoking/canning issue and the impact on possession limits. I'll report back on here as soon as I hear back from them.

I'll be back at the Gorge from 2 to 4 August. I may have to bring my canner if Utah allows it as Wyoming does.

 

[sawhorseray]

Thanks for that Dubob! The fishing was great when we were there a couple of weeks ago and I'm pretty sure it'll hold out until we get back there next Thursday. All our fish were caught on pink & orange rigs 10" behind a Sep's flasher straight out from Buckboard around the island and along the cliffs.

The possession limit seems kind of tight, and it's easy enough to not even notice when a couple of days go by. It's no big deal, unless and until a man runs afoul of the law, and it happens. That's when you hear the horror stories of thousands of dollars in fines and boat confiscations. Hell, when I was fishing the west coast for forty years I saw DFG inspect each and every boat leaving the harbor a few times. They even tried to buy crab, and then salmon, from my partner and I in a undercover attempt a couple of times. I don't blame them, that's their job, enforcing the law, tho that seemed close to entrapment. I just choose to try and stay on the right side of things, then there's absolutely nothing to worry about but staying safe. RAY

 

[dubob]

Utah Guidelines

Ray,

I finally heard back from a conservation officer for the Utah Division of Wildlife. Here is what he had to say with regards to Flaming Gorge.

Robert,

I am a conservation officer for the Division of Wildlife. In answer to your question regarding smoked or pressure canned fish and your possession limit. On Page 18 of the fishing guide book it states at Flaming Gorge you may only have one daily limit in your possession in the field or in transport. Unless you return back to your permanent residence, you can only posses one daily limit regardless if they are canned or not. At Flaming Gorge you can filet the fish after you have completed the act of fishing, arrived at camp, reached a fish-cleaning station, or arrived at you principle means of land transportation, but each fish would still count toward your possession limit. This would include any processing of the fish. I hope this answers your questions. Let me know if you have any other questions.

So if you stay in Wyoming and do some pressure canning there, you would be legal. However, as soon as you passed into Utah on your return home, you would be in violation of Utah laws regarding possession limit in the field/in transit. Possession limits apply equally to residents and non-residents alike in Utah. Even if just passing through, you are subject to the possession restrictions.
bandmyhead

 

[sawhorseray]

We just got back from the Gorge, had to cut the trip four days short due to my wife getting a sinus infection. We only got to fish Friday and Saturday, both days great weather. Friday was limits in a hour and a half at the Island straight across from Buckboard. All fish 17"-18" caught on pink-orange hoochie rigs @ 40', 10"lead to flasher, 20' setback. Saturday we settled for three nice kokes after turning three others loose, I'm not greedy. Wyoming DFG flagged us down in the harbor right as we're entering our slip area, gave the full inspection, asked a lot of questions about possession limit. I had licenses, mussel tags, FG recreation tag, boat had all the needed equipment, no way to get a ticket. I told the officer I canned my fish daily, he said" exactly who told you that's legal?". I replied "Mark Smith, Wyoming Fisheries Management Assistant". I told him I printed the email I'd received and had a copy of it in the glove compartment of my truck if he'd care to come by and see it. One guy was pretty nice, thanked us for our compliance and courtesy, the other guy really wanted to give me a ticket. He asks to see the date on the fire extinguisher after my wife had put it back, she goes to get it and cuts her hand a little. End of show! My DW was a CFO in the Silicon Valley for 30 years and eats lawyers for lunch. She starts screaming at Captain Crabby wanting to know why he's attempting to be such a major a$$wipe, why he wasn't smart enough to look at the date when she handed it to him the first time, and now due to his inefficiency she's cut herself. The nice guy was laughing as they boated away with my DW using a little foul language in a raised voice towards his partner. Maybe we'll see them again next year. I think they'll remember us. RAY

 

[DLM]

Very interesting conversations.

After canning can anyone tell how many fish you have in your possession? Obviously they cannot. A pint may hold two fish from one lake but only one fillet from a large fish from another lake.

I know of one fisherman here in Oregon that camps at a particular lake for a full month in late spring, and cans every day. In his case it would be easy to assume he has more than a two day limit in his possession.laugh hyst

 

[dubob]

Every state is different

After canning can anyone tell how many fish you have in your possession? Obviously they cannot. A pint may hold two fish from one lake but only one fillet from a large fish from another lake.

Since there is no possession limit at your permanent place of residence in Utah, it doesn't really matter in Utah once the jars are at your permanent residence. I wouldn't recommend canning them in the field in Utah. However, this may not be the case in Oregon or other states. From what we were told about Wyoming, after canning (even in the field), it doesn't matter there either.