timothy kokanee kill off

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rainORsnow1

rainORsnow1

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Jan 31, 2012
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Location
milwaukie, OR
Just heard on outdoor GPS pge is blocking the spawning tributaries to thin off the kokanee and brook trout. Anybody know if this is an effort to grow the population to a larger size or a negative thing. Hopefully this is wat us Portland kokanee lovers have been waiting for. A quality kokanee spot within an hour of Portland would be phenominal!
 
I am certainly no fish biologist, but to me less spawing would equal less fish, which would equal more food available for those that remain, and more food should equal bigger fish.

We all wonder what happened at Suttle Lake, which now produces tons of little fish. It seems to me that this started happening about the time the landowner at Blue Lake took out the ware (sp?) in Link Creek, thus allowing more spawning area. Again, no expert here, just thinking out loud.

I would like to hear Kenamatics take on this, but he is probably out sitting on a stump somewhere looking for furry things.
 
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It seems strange to me unless the lake is 100% self sustaining. In my mind, F&G just reduces or eliminates plants instead of paying tax dollars to stop something that appears to be doing well naturally. I'd also think that needing less plants would allow for more fish to go other places where they are really needed.
 
I live in Gresham. How cool would it be to have great Kokanee fishing at Timothy. GP is 250 mile round trip and at $4.00 a gallon for fuel, that hurts. We went to Timothy earlier this year and the fish were smaller than green label herring. And the females were loaded with eggs. That's just way to small.
 
So those of u who are interested in an update, I checked with my brother who works for odfw and sure enough they are thinning the fish. But kokanee are not the target. Brookies are. This was dissapointing to me at first even though it will still effect the kokanee spawn a bit seeing how they don't necessarily need a stream to spawn but do spawn in the tributaries. But this is where it gets kind of interesting again. I have done further research and found that they are targeting the brook trout to thin competition for the bull trout they are transplanting from L.B.C. Wildlife
managers feel the population could take off. It will be a while seeing how slow they grow but something to look forward to in the future. Probably bad news for the kokanee 25 bag limit as anybody who knows about L.B.C.knows. but exciting for a threatened fish
 
I remember years ago when the bull trout (arctic char) had no limits on 'em in eastern Oregon. As many as you wanted and size was no problem. Take 'em home for fertilizer or pitch 'em on the bank. They were actually trying to get rid of the pesky things! Since some dim bulb that probably had never been out of DC decided that they were an "endangered" species and no longer were to be caught, the salmon population has been declining. I live close to a small stream that is a tributary to the upper North Fork of the John Day river and back then you'd go cross eyed counting the returning salmon in the various holes. Now, if you see more than one or two a day consider yourself lucky.

I'll bet that if those carnivorous bull trout are transplanted, you can just about kiss good fishing good bye in a few years. Their favorite prey is, you guessed it. .the fingerlings and smolts.
 
This was a few years after the John Day dam was built so the dams aren't totally to blame for the salmon population decline. In the early 1990's a number of local creeks were closed to all fishing supposedly to allow the salmon population to grow, this was about the same time that the bull trout were declared "endangered". Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions but several fishing buddies agree with my assessment, these are guys who have fished these creeks for the last 30- 40 years.
 
I feel that if they are targeting the kokanee or brookies, the effect should be the same and the next few years will tell if our theories are correct and some of these lakes with small kokes need some thinning. With limiting spawning and reintroducing bull trout (I heard this also while at LBC earlier this month) I think that there will definitely be less kokanee in there and conventional wisdom would lead me to believe that the kokanee should get larger (gosh I hope so!!!!). If we don't see an increase in size in 3-6 years (1-2 full cycles) it will make me really say hummm. I think that 2 full cycles will be when we see any real effects as this will be the first mature group with less numbers. If this works I will be the first to stand up and say a large THANK YOU to ODFW even though I have disagreed with some of the resource management decisions recently (especially leaving hoocies classified as "bait"). I will be keeping my fingers crossed for Timothy. And by the way DLM, Dawnell and I both ended out deer season in the first week so more sausage for the derbies next year (yum).
 
I'm really hoping it works that way. Being from portland and just acquiring the kokanee bug this last season, it gets old driving all over the place in search of the big guys. I literally put 12000 miles on my new truck just this season. Great to get to fish all those beautiful lakes. But if I could load up my boat and drive 45min to timothy, no contest. It would be great to have a bull trout fishery as well.(although they probably won't let us fish for them for years) I've only caught a couple but man those things fight like hell. We should all band up like I read on the green peter thread and get a head start. Let's just fish em all winter and take 25 of the little guys home. They make great table fare and make great catfish/sturgeon bait. (Make sure u cut em up though, could cost u a big to ticket otherwise)
 
DLM said:
Love that road kill! laugh hyst
Click to expand...
You're killing me man!! Although I have been known to eat road kill a time or two (had to cross two lanes to hit that pheasant). On the Timothy note, I think that winter fishing Timothy may be a little difficult. It will be great if ODFW can come up with a good koke fishery in the area. If there is anything we as kokanee nuts (and maybe Kokanee Power) can do to help out, I would be more than eager. We may even be able to get help from the fisheries program at Mt Hood Comm College as they need to do a field project as part of a class.
 
Shame on you for even thinking about using kokanee for bait!!! Better to use those durned bull trout instead. I've accidentally caught a few of 'em and don't see that they fight any better than brookies. They're a bit more aggressive when they hit but that's about all. I didn't find 'em particularly tasty, not even smoked but I'll admit smoked bull trout is better than no smoked trout at all. . .
 
Whoa dude. U have an agenda obviously. But wasn't it u talking about throwing fish on the bank? That's pretty brutal if u ask me. But anyways. That's a great idea kenamatic!
 
Agenda? Yup, that I do have, mainly catching up on hunting and fishing now that I'm retired. And yes, years ago bull trout were considered trash fish. Now when I catch one, I smuggle it home and into the smoker, then mix the meat with rainbow, brookies and small kokanee in a dip I make.

As far as 'em fighting, I don't see any difference between them and any other trout. It seems they hit harder but that could be that they usually take the hook all the way down their gullet. Taking the hook out kills 'em and I can't see tossing 'em back 'cuz they're not gonna live anyway.

This kind of reminds me of "Quigley Down Under" where towards the end of the movie the bad guy stuffs a Colt revolver into Quigley's belt. Of course Quigley shoots both the bad guy and his henchman. As the baddy is dying he says something to the effect that he didn't think Quigley could use a revolver. Quigley says "Never said I couldn't use 'em, what I said was I didn't have much use for 'em".

That pretty much sums up how I feel about bull trout :lol:
 
Make sure you check Oregon fishing regulation as some lakes Bull trout are considered a indangered species and illegal to harvest and were they are legal, there is a special measurement required. Don't shoot yourself in the foot.
 
So in other words, if and when I catch one, I take the hook out and toss it back knowing it's not gonna live? Or maybe put a little sign on the lure telling bull trout not to hit it????
 

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